LDS & Christians Rejecting the Lord on Political Grounds
Christopher Hansen writes:
> We must be able to preach the gospel there too. What is the three pronged
> responsibility of the church. Remember that politics is not one of those.
> To preach the gospel to the whole world is. Dealing with these wicked
> governments has enabled us to preach the gospel there. That is more
> important than politics.
Christopher, my countering this very mindset is one of the primary reasons I was excommunicated from
the Mormon Church. I was going around in a speaking circuit teaching that being a light to the world
in regards to establishing a government of God that would protect the freedom of all mankind was
supposed to have been one of the PRIMARY objectives of the latter-day saints; and that the Mormon's
negligence in this regard was one of the primary reasons they have become as salt that has lost its
savor, as prophesied in places such as 3 Nephi 16.
Conversely, the Lord's people, anciently, the Jews, were focused on the idea that the kingdom of God
was a government, but what their Messiah brought to them was the gospel, which deals with the
salvation of the individual. The Lord's people in these last days (the Christians in general, and
the Mormons in particular) are focused on the idea that the kingdom of God is all about the gospel,
but the commission they were given was to build on the foundation of the gospel and establish a
government of God, which would be for the temporal safety (salvation) of society as a whole.
The first shall be last, the last shall be first. The Jews erred then, by looking beyond the mark,
and the Mormons/Christians are erring now by looking beyond the mark.
The kingdom of God is BOTH -- the gospel AND the government of God. Individual salvation and
societal protection of freedom. The Jews had more than ample reason to believe the kingdom would be
a government. "...and the government shall be upon his shoulder." The Christians/Mormons
have more than ample reason to believe the kingdom has to do with the gospel. The truth is that it
is not a matter of one or the other. IT IS BOTH.
The Mormons, like the Jews anciently, are not only neglecting to address adequately this injunction
they were given, but they actually persecute those among them who seek to be part of defending
freedom and promoting an alternative to the socialist New World Order. They are, in effect,
rejecting and denying the Lord in this regard just as profoundly as the Jews did anciently by
rejecting and denying Jesus Christ when he came among them to establish the gospel foundation for
their individual lives.
The gospel had to be established first, before a government could be established, because no matter
how good your government structure is, if the people are not righteous, they will end up with
tyranny, because that is what they deserve. It requires individual responsibility and a certain
degree of upright living for a society to be able to enjoy freedom.
So you are correct, the establishment of the government of God on earth is NOT part of the stated
"three-pronged mission of the LDS church" as currently constituted; and that, my friend,
is one of the primary reasons why it fails to be the light to the world that it was commissioned to
be when it comes to opposing Satan's government (the NWO) and establishing a government of freedom
as an alternative.
It's not so much that the church itself is to be the instigator of a government based on freedom as
much as they should be encouraging of its members to be part of such. It would be appropriate for
them to teach the general principles of freedom, and it would be appropriate for their mission
statement to include a reference to the need for its members to be part of establishing a government
to protect the freedom of all mankind. They certainly should not be the impediment that they are
today, and they certainly should not be in bed with the enemies of freedom, just for the sake of
being able to teach the gospel in their countries.
The rise of the beast in the latter days is the fault of the Christians/Mormons more than anything,
because they allowed this secret combination to get above them, when they were commanded to keep
this from happening (Ether 8). The beast's making war with the saints, is not so much going to be
about persecuting the "Lord's chosen people" as much as it is going to be the 'saints'
receiving the consequence of their choices -- allowing this beast to get above them.
The promise of the gospel is that if a person builds on that foundation, the gates of hell will not
prevail against them. Right? Right. You know that this is a true maxim, taught clearly both in the
Bible and Book of Mormon.
You also know that there are prophecies in Daniel 7; Revelation 13; III Nephi 16, 20, 21; and
D&C 103 that prophecy that Satan, the beast, is going to make war with the saints AND PREVAIL
AGAINST THEM for 3.5 years.
Why? Because they have not build upon the rock as they supposed they had. It certainly is not
because God does not keep his promise that the gates of hell will not prevail upon those who are
build upon his rock.
In large measure this will be because they have neglected their responsibility toward freedom.
The modern scribes/Pharisees/Sanhedrin, who oppose the work of God in their midst, in fulfillment of
prophecy, is manifest today in the leadership of the church. This is almost impossible to see
without this understanding of 'the first shall be last, and the last shall be first.'
Indeed, a setting in order is due. Remember, the JST says that the wheat are gathered out first, and
then the tares are left to be burned.
Go ye out from the midst of her. Be ye clean that bear the vessels of the Lord.
Sterling D. Allan
facilitator, Remnant Saints Inter-Continental Congress
Constitution & Gospel -- the Law and the Word of the Lord
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 14:13:37 -0800
From: Christopher Hansen <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Subject: Re: LDS derision of patriots and their support of NWO not overt, but still substantial
At 08:41 AM 2/10/2002 -0700, you wrote:
>Christopher Hansen writes:
> > Can you name one commandment on how we should live our lives so we can be
> > good and joyous and live happier lives that our Modern day prophets have
> > given that were wrong.
>It is not in the overt statements that deception is found coming from the
>brethren, whom the LDS members follow as if they were God himself speaking
God Himself does speak to them. They make errors as do we, as Paul and
Peter and Joshua and Moses did.
>It is in the subtle culture that the deception is fostered and perpetuated.
But the Prophets and apostles have warned us against such actions by the
body of the people.
>When we see members of the Quorum of the Twelve being all patsy patsy with
>Communist leaders, what kind of statement does that make?
That we live in a world of men. What did it mean when Peter had dealings
with the men that killed Christ? What about Paul having dealings with Rome
and other Pagan governments. David and other prophets had dealings with
wicked men. Some were corrupted. Others were not. But they had dealings
with wicked governments.
> When we see the
>socialists of the church who are rich and famous being wined and dined in
>the Church Office building, while the hard core patriots are snuffed at
>every turn, what kind of statement does that make?
I have not found this to be completely correct. Some socialists have been
wined and dined but remember that even the apostles and prophets of our
church must be tested. What the members are supposed to do about Socialism
is clear. The membership has rejected the counsel of the prophets of just
like the ancient Israelites rejected the prophet and took a king to rule
over them. I have not been rejected by the leaders of the church but have
been placed in positions of authority including the fulfillment of the
Prophet Benson concerning who would be called to POLITICAL church callings.
I was called to a political church calling.
> When Gordon B. Hinckley
>is asked in a Regional Conference Priesthood Question Answer session in
>Payson, Utah in 1992, what he thinks of the New World Order, and he replies,
>"seems good enough to me," what kind of message does that send?
It sends a message the Hinkley is not required to preach opposition because
the people rejected the former prophets. I did not get to read the whole
quote and I would like to see it but Hinkley also said that if all men were
like President Benson the foundations of Hell would be shaken forever. What
kind of message is does that send?
>It's not official church policy, but everyone 'in the know,' knows that the
>Brethren in general are not avid pro-Constitutionalist, but are friendly to
I do not see that in their speeches. In fact Apostle Wirthlin and Faust
have given excellent speeches warning us against civil religions and loss
The OFFICIAL policy of the church is extremely pro-Constitutional and we
have been commanded to uphold that God given document and were condemned
by Benson for not doing so.
>Brigham Young University sports several members of the Council of Foreign
>Relations on its faculty (e.g. Earl Fry),
The Seventy called a CFR member Stahli (sp?). He helped open the church in
areas that we could not have done with other men. The Lord often calls evil
men to assist in the work. Would you condemn Christ for calling Judas as an
Apostle? We are NOT the leaders of the church and we cannot see the whole
picture nor do we have the keys to know what they know or how to direct the
church. We are called to sustain them and that means that if we see they
are falling into error we are commanded to tell them. Have you told the
Apostles that you are concerned for them and their political failures? I have.
>but not one member of the John
>Birch Society (that I know of).
I am not a member of the JBS and would not join that organization. I
believe they have become a hindrance to the right wing movement. And I do
not know all the professors at BYU. I would not send my children to BYU.
> They even have a building named after a
>deceased member of the Council on Foreign Relations: David M. Kennedy Center
>(http://kennedy.byu.edu). You better believe they would
never have a Cleon
>Skousen Center. To their credit, though, in earlier days, at least they let
>Cleon teach a few classes.
And McKay, Grant and Benson were prophets and the people rejected their
counsel and commandments. The people must be held accountable. The third
and forth generations are being punished for the sins of their parents. God
will force no man to heaven. Look at Jim's responses to me concerning
Social Security. He refuses to believe the truth NO MATTER what it is
because it will hurt his plans to STOP BEING A SOCIALIST. Read in Helaman
(remember the BofM is for the latter-day) where the majority of the members
of the church joined with the Gadianton robbers. The church will soon
divide as it did in those days. It MUST happen. What will lead to this.
Politics is what!
> David M. Kennedy served in the official capacity
>as "advisor to the First Presidency" for several years prior to his passing.
So did Judas.
>Stan Taylor, avid pro New World Order, Political Science Department Chairman
>at BYU, is one of the key advisors to the brethren regarding their policy
>toward Communist/Socialist nations.
We must be able to preach the gospel there too. What is the three pronged
responsibility of the church. Remember that politics is not one of those.
To preach the gospel to the whole world is. Dealing with these wicked
governments has enabled us to preach the gospel there. That is more
important than politics.
>I know. He told me this in his
>office -- gloating. He also told me, "I am like this (holding his index and
>middle fingers twisted together) with the brethren, and I can tell you that
>they do not share Ezra Taft Benson's views about politics and conspiracy."
>(1989). He also told me that my book 'The Vision of All: Our Past, Present,
>and Future as Foretold in Book of Mormon History' was a waste of time and
>that I should find better things to do with myself. (It quotes Ezra Taft
>Benson over 100 times, warning about the Conspiracy to establish world
>socialist government.) In one of his required courses, he methodically
>debunks Cleon Skousen's "The Naked Communist," as well as Gary Allen's "None
>Dare Call it Conspiracy." Or at least he did at the time we spoke. He
>probably doesn't need to any more, as those books are so thoroughly
>discredited among the LDS now (thanks to his and other's efforts) -- even
>though they are fantastic books. Gary Allen's book is what woke me up when
>I was a Senior at BYU. And about the only reason I took it serious is
>because on the back cover was an endorsement by Ezra Taft Benson.
The servants of the church are being tested too. There will be a division
and it will be awful. Keep your eye on the majority of the 12 was the
prophets Joseph's counsel. Work hard and prepare for the split. It WILL HAPPEN.
>Today, Gordon B. Hinckley's books are endorsed by the likes of Larry King,
>no friend of Constitutionalists.
That is a good book. I would endorse it to any one. I do not disagree with
it. Are you saying I am not a friend of the Constitution.
>Now that Ezra Taft Benson and H. Verlan Anderson have passed away, the
>circle of brethren is virtual void of solid patriots so far as I know.
Look what happened not long after the death of Moroni. Are you ready. I am
not. But it is coming.
>Instead, now there is at least one member of the Council on Foreign
>Relations who is a General Authority -- Donald Staheli.
I almost got excommunicated over him. Remember that Christ called Judas.
>Look at who BYU invites as its commencement speakers, and you will see this
>pattern more vividly. It hit an all time low in 1991 when they had General
>Brent Scowcroft (CFR) speak at Commencement. Fourteen times he mentioned
>the New World Order. This was during the Gulf War, when GWB's dad was
>trumpeting the NWO like it was the next best thing since apple pie.
And what was Joseph Smith's prophesy concerning this. The priesthood will
be lost by such men and even the very elect will be deceived.
>None of this talk (pro or con) ever makes its way into General Conference,
>but it does create a subcultural understanding that woos the LDS masses to
>sleep when it comes to an understanding of the awful situation that we are
>in. 'Everyone knows' that patriots are anathema, and that there really
>isn't anything wrong with the New World Order.
Everyone in my ward does not know that. I am watching a change in the
membership as they learn on their own. The sheep must be separated from the
goats EVEN within the true and Everlasting Gospel.
>You won't hear that from the pulpit,
AND THAT IS THE KEY.
>but you will get it from your bishop or
I do not. My bishop supports me. I have no problems with my Stake President
although my last one was a 100% pure Socialist and caused me a lot of
problems but I called him to repentance and made him shake before me. All
me must be tested.
> I've heard so many stories from people for whom this was
And were they prepared? Most were not. I was called into a bishops office
to find out why I had upset the teacher so badly. I told the bishop that
the teacher was preaching false doctrine and all I did was quote the
prophets. The bishop told me I had better not upset the teacher again. I
told him that I would upset anyone that preached false doctrine and that if
I was not allowed to quote the prophets in class that I would report it to
the prophets or that I would demand a Church Court to see who was correct.
The Bishop backed down. He admitted that the teacher was wrong and that
teacher did not teach again.
My calling through the laying on of hands by those in authority is to
direct the affairs of men. That is NOT THE CALLING OF THE APOSTLES nor the
The sheep and goats are being separated and tested. Isn't it wonderful that
we know the truth and have the opportunity to spread the gospel of liberty?!
>So no, I do not anticipate that the brethren would ever get up in General
>Conference and tell people they should take the mark of the beast, but you
>better believe the subculture will support it.
And so they will embrace the plans of Gadianton just like in the days of
Helaman just like it MUST HAPPEN!!!! Do you have a Social Security Number?
What says you do not already have the Mark of the Beast that President
Grant warned us against!
The Prophet and all but three of the apostles supported Wilson's NWO League
of Nations but Apostle and Senator Smoot voted against it and defeated it.
The majority of the Apostles also supported the liquore amendments. That is
right "AMENDMENTS". They had to vote for the repeal of the first one. They
are not perfect and frankly they are, as you have pointed out, political
MORONS. Oaks is the worst of them all.
>Of course it will not be
>marketed as "the mark of the beast," but something more benign sounding,
>such as "homeland security identification implant."
Or Social Security number enforced by Title 42 Section 666. Do you have
this number that President Grant "to my mind it is in direct opposition to
everything I have quoted from Brigham Young and from the revelations of the
Do you have a Social Security Number?
>Wake up, my friend, and stop making excuses for the spiritual bastards who
>have taken over the Lord's vineyard. The remnant are being gathered out.
Wrong. the Remnant will remain true to the WHOLE gospel. The Socialists
will be separated out. You are planting the seeds of your own destruction.
You sound like Oliver Cowdry or David Whitmer.
You are on very dangerous ground. I was there once and I completely
understand how you feel. I have been given revelation on how I should act.
When I asked God why He would have called such a Socialist to be my Stake
President I was told in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS and in a clear voice I was told
that "He was the best man in the Stake I could find." And then I was asked,
"Were you worthy to be the Stake President so I could have called you?" And
I had to admit that I was not and that that was not within my talents
anyway. And then I was told that all me were to be tested and this was a
test on the Stake President that he had failed. I was a part of that. Read
the book of Alma on how the righteous need to suffer to condemn the wicked
and I knew I was not even righteous and that the denial of my temple
recommend by this Socialist was the correct decision and turned out to be a
great blessing to me because I was about to have my adopted daughter sealed
to me and she was not worthy and not ready. God intervened and I grew
spiritually like I never have before. All of this because of a Socialist
God has seen fit to give these men the Keys. He did not see fit to give
them to you. You had best consider that and decide what your calling and
duty is and how you will fulfill your calling and not tell the prophet how
to run the church. Your life is your own. Act accordingly.
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