From: L.M. Enterprises <htrails@solve.net>
To: Davids_Outcasts@listbot.com
<Davids_Outcasts@listbot.com>
Date: Tuesday, October 19, 1999 11:52 AM
Subject: (888) DZs Testimony
DZ,
Thanks so much for sharing your "...quest for God." You're truly
a seeker. I can empathize and somewhat relate. I think all of us can to some
degree. All of us have our ups and downs, our moments of angst with the
"Hound of Heaven." Our periods when the heavens are closed and God
is silent. The Psalmist said it well, "...How long, Lord? Wilt thou hide
thyself for ever?...(Psa.89:46). I hear you. My heart was touched as I read
your testimony. I have just a few rambling thoughts...
First, regarding becoming a seeker. I'm convinced, this matter of
"finding God" is a paradox. We seek Him with all our hearts, and
once we find him, we turn into seekers. We then seek him with all our hearts.
I believe that's one of the best evidences of having found the Lord——of
seeking Him. Sinners don't seek God. Only the faithful yearn after him. David
said it well, "...As the hart panteth after the water brooks, so panteth
my soul after thee, O God" (Psa.42:1). Jesus said, "...seek and ye
shall find, knock and it shall be opened to you." That's a paradox.
Second, regarding the matter of faith and experience. In your testimony, it
seems you desired with all your heart to know God——for him to speak and to
reveal himself. Truly noble and godly desires. The realm of experience,
however, is slippery, and can slip away much like a squid in water. By
definition, "experience" is non-definitive. Even the word itself.
Faith, though experiential, cannot be defined. Even its biblical definition
(Hebrews 11:1) is really not a definition, but faith in action. That's why the
Christian's faith is based upon, and rooted in, history——the fact of
Calvary. It's not existential. Which leads to our third thought...
Your father's agnosticism. He seemed intent in placing the Christian faith
in the realm of proof, not evidence. But "real" Christianity is
lived out in the arena of history, not the science laboratory. History is
based on evidence, not proofs. Proofs are based upon repeatable experiments.
One cannot repeat moments of history. Often an agnostic applies a scientific
grid [paradigm] to religion and it simply doesn't fit. He or she typically
makes the statement "……religion may make you happy, and that's fine.
But it doesn't work for me." Problem: the epistemological cat is chasing
its tail. He's really saying..."religion's a matter of
interpretation." But that won't do. For instance, my uncle (who's an
agnostic) says to me, at times, when discussing the Bible at our annual family
reunions, "...that's simply your interpretation." My response? If my
interpretation of the Bible is wrong because it's my interpretation, then my
uncle's opinion of my interpretation is wrong because it's his opinion. See.
The epistemological cat is chasing his tail. And going nowhere. Wrong
paradigm.
Next. Sounds like you've discovered a friendly, exciting Charismatic,
non-denominational fellowship——called Community Chapel where people
probably raise their hands in worship, clap, shout (at times), where healings
and miracles are witnessed, and demonic deliverances occur, and where
spiritual gifts operate. That's great. I mean that. Here's the irony. All of
the above is why I embraced the restoration gospel. I've often said, if Joseph
Smith were alive today, he would "out-charismatic" the charismatics!
Joseph Smith was a "non-denominational charismatic." He moved in the
gifts of the Spirit; his leaders moved in the gifts. Worship services were
exciting, filled with the glory of the Lord, and the anointing of His
presence. Angels visited, sang, and ministered in their meetings. Joseph
Smith's meetings were much like today's Benny Hinn's healing crusades——filled
with spontaneous supernatural manifestations. I sometimes tell my charismatic
friends, the modern-day pentecostal outpouring occurred in the midwest, not
out west in California on Azusa street. A tremendous outpouring of the Holy
Spirit first occurred in 1836 in Kirtland, Ohio. Not 1900 in California.That's
64 years before the renowned Azusa street visitation.
Joseph said, "...The gifts which follow them that believe and obey the
gospel……began to be poured out among us, as in ancient days..."
I've been in services with fellow restoration saints (Book of Mormon
believers) where divine healings were witnessed, where singing in the spirit
(in tongues) occurred, where tongues and prophecy were given, where uplifted
hands, praise and worship was enjoyed by all. I've seen saints overcome
(slain) by the Holy Spirit, lying on the floor with rapturous looks on their
glowing faces. I've seen the spontaneity of the Spirit——holy laughter——come
on some. I've seen His presence in our midst.
Irony of ironies. My wife, daughter, and I are "tongue-talking,
hand-raising, praisers and worshippers" who found the charismatic
movement within the restoration gospel. My point? I just don't think we have
to throw the baby out with the bath water.
At any rate, I truly was moved by your sincere testimony.
Lynn Ridenhour
